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	<title>Comments on: How important is college?</title>
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	<link>http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/</link>
	<description>A web site by Joshua Sowin that addresses culture, books, technology, ecology, religion, and other topics.</description>
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		<title>By: Jay</title>
		<link>http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/comment-page-1/#comment-269744</link>
		<dc:creator>Jay</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 Dec 2011 15:58:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/#comment-269744</guid>
		<description>Well, it is up to ones own perspective.  however if you are looking to attend college for an education, i would not find that as a feasible reason. Information is at our finger tips, book stores, library etc. Gaining information is acquiring knowledge/Education. as josh pointed out, a degree is necessary for a doctor, lawyer, engineer etc...But for an entrepreneur like myself, it is not at all necessary. Self education IS....</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, it is up to ones own perspective.  however if you are looking to attend college for an education, i would not find that as a feasible reason. Information is at our finger tips, book stores, library etc. Gaining information is acquiring knowledge/Education. as josh pointed out, a degree is necessary for a doctor, lawyer, engineer etc&#8230;But for an entrepreneur like myself, it is not at all necessary. Self education IS&#8230;.</p>
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		<title>By: Richard</title>
		<link>http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/comment-page-1/#comment-269363</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Nov 2011 22:44:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/#comment-269363</guid>
		<description>I would say that if you want to study and achieve credentials then do so. I am 47 and studying for a second masters degree. Not because I have to but because I want to. I have uncles who never finished high school but built their own homes with their own hands.  Do I wish I could do that?, sure I do. But I have never fallen of a ladder!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I would say that if you want to study and achieve credentials then do so. I am 47 and studying for a second masters degree. Not because I have to but because I want to. I have uncles who never finished high school but built their own homes with their own hands.  Do I wish I could do that?, sure I do. But I have never fallen of a ladder!</p>
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		<title>By: C.W.</title>
		<link>http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/comment-page-1/#comment-258662</link>
		<dc:creator>C.W.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Aug 2011 08:08:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/#comment-258662</guid>
		<description>My uncle and grandfather learnt mechanical engineering through autodidacticism, or self education. Both were rather prominent in their fields. My uncle made/invented tools for micro-surgery. And my grandfather designed HVAC systems. Both did quite well for themselves. The days of self-education are waning but it&#039;s not impossible. A college education costs a lot of money, and people like myself do not wish to bear the burden of the debt one accumulates through the course of such an endeavor. There are many prominent figures throughout history who have taught themselves in a particular field and had success. Leonardo Da Vinci only received training in the arts through the Guild system, just like nearly all Renaissance artists.  But he&#039;s also a well known engineer, anatomist, scientist, mathematician, inventor, etc. He was self educated in all fields except the arts. Henry Knox the General and Commander of the Continental Artillery during the American Revolution was self educated. Abraham Lincoln was self educated. The founding fathers of flight, the Wright Brothers were self educated. Ronnie Barret the designer of the first semi automatic .50 caliber sniper rifle is self educated. He produced a rifle chambered for a very powerful cartridge (that is not easy to design for a portable platform) without a background in engineering or manufacturing, but he still pulled it off. 

I could list more people or prominent institutions that were founded by autodidacts, but I won&#039;t. The point is, a college degree doesn&#039;t equate to your ability to be successful or even land a good job. I know a lot of people who have degrees but are suffering to find jobs. Colleges also don&#039;t teach you everything you need to know. How do you deal with people? How do you overcome financial pitfalls or obstacles that are specific to your company? Through experience and learning that takes place on the job. Colleges teach knowledge through experience. Basically, everything that is taught in schools was at some point learnt by someone who decided to go out into the world and just do it. I am by no means discrediting college, instead I am suggesting that it is not necessary for fruitful career.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My uncle and grandfather learnt mechanical engineering through autodidacticism, or self education. Both were rather prominent in their fields. My uncle made/invented tools for micro-surgery. And my grandfather designed HVAC systems. Both did quite well for themselves. The days of self-education are waning but it&#8217;s not impossible. A college education costs a lot of money, and people like myself do not wish to bear the burden of the debt one accumulates through the course of such an endeavor. There are many prominent figures throughout history who have taught themselves in a particular field and had success. Leonardo Da Vinci only received training in the arts through the Guild system, just like nearly all Renaissance artists.  But he&#8217;s also a well known engineer, anatomist, scientist, mathematician, inventor, etc. He was self educated in all fields except the arts. Henry Knox the General and Commander of the Continental Artillery during the American Revolution was self educated. Abraham Lincoln was self educated. The founding fathers of flight, the Wright Brothers were self educated. Ronnie Barret the designer of the first semi automatic .50 caliber sniper rifle is self educated. He produced a rifle chambered for a very powerful cartridge (that is not easy to design for a portable platform) without a background in engineering or manufacturing, but he still pulled it off. </p>
<p>I could list more people or prominent institutions that were founded by autodidacts, but I won&#8217;t. The point is, a college degree doesn&#8217;t equate to your ability to be successful or even land a good job. I know a lot of people who have degrees but are suffering to find jobs. Colleges also don&#8217;t teach you everything you need to know. How do you deal with people? How do you overcome financial pitfalls or obstacles that are specific to your company? Through experience and learning that takes place on the job. Colleges teach knowledge through experience. Basically, everything that is taught in schools was at some point learnt by someone who decided to go out into the world and just do it. I am by no means discrediting college, instead I am suggesting that it is not necessary for fruitful career.</p>
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		<title>By: J.R.</title>
		<link>http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/comment-page-1/#comment-213926</link>
		<dc:creator>J.R.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Feb 2011 08:58:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/#comment-213926</guid>
		<description>Nel P: I graduated with an A.A. a number of years ago. It hasn&#039;t helped me one iota. Now let me ask you something, even though I doubt you&#039;ll ever read this...

How is it that two more years of &quot;structured&quot; &quot;formalized&quot; &quot;accredited&quot; education is going to make me that much more desirable to employers? There&#039;s not a single thing you can do in this world for two years that will make you that much more an outstanding individual. I&#039;ve had enough years on this earth to recognize that. In fact, I can break this down further.

For me to obtain my B.A., I would have to take twenty more classes. Twenty. It&#039;s a joke. Twenty classes is nothing. I read the equivalent of twenty college books in a single year, easily. Not that I ever had to read my college textbooks to get straight As. College is a joke - for some of us.

It was for me, anyway. Some people do actually need college to reach a particular level of cognitive and cultural/social development. I didn&#039;t. My education will be lifelong, and there is no piece of paper at the end of it. Just a casket, like everyone else.

I&#039;d rather work a variety of jobs, build an impressive resume, and always have that A.A. there to spice it up - and hey, maybe I&#039;ll take a few courses here and there, get a B.A. ten years from now, or an M.A...or maybe even a PhD! But I don&#039;t think living in dormitories and avoiding the real world is the right sort of education for people. You want an education, go work in manual labor for awhile...and recognize how much work goes into producing ANYTHING of PHYSICAL value.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nel P: I graduated with an A.A. a number of years ago. It hasn&#8217;t helped me one iota. Now let me ask you something, even though I doubt you&#8217;ll ever read this&#8230;</p>
<p>How is it that two more years of &#8220;structured&#8221; &#8220;formalized&#8221; &#8220;accredited&#8221; education is going to make me that much more desirable to employers? There&#8217;s not a single thing you can do in this world for two years that will make you that much more an outstanding individual. I&#8217;ve had enough years on this earth to recognize that. In fact, I can break this down further.</p>
<p>For me to obtain my B.A., I would have to take twenty more classes. Twenty. It&#8217;s a joke. Twenty classes is nothing. I read the equivalent of twenty college books in a single year, easily. Not that I ever had to read my college textbooks to get straight As. College is a joke &#8211; for some of us.</p>
<p>It was for me, anyway. Some people do actually need college to reach a particular level of cognitive and cultural/social development. I didn&#8217;t. My education will be lifelong, and there is no piece of paper at the end of it. Just a casket, like everyone else.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d rather work a variety of jobs, build an impressive resume, and always have that A.A. there to spice it up &#8211; and hey, maybe I&#8217;ll take a few courses here and there, get a B.A. ten years from now, or an M.A&#8230;or maybe even a PhD! But I don&#8217;t think living in dormitories and avoiding the real world is the right sort of education for people. You want an education, go work in manual labor for awhile&#8230;and recognize how much work goes into producing ANYTHING of PHYSICAL value.</p>
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		<title>By: franca</title>
		<link>http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/comment-page-1/#comment-154650</link>
		<dc:creator>franca</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 26 Jul 2010 19:12:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/#comment-154650</guid>
		<description>thanks for posting this,im a high school graduate and i&#039;ve been thinking about this issue&#039;&#039;the importance college education&#039;&#039; for a while now.i read all the comments and that really helped me alot.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>thanks for posting this,im a high school graduate and i&#8217;ve been thinking about this issue&#8221;the importance college education&#8221; for a while now.i read all the comments and that really helped me alot.</p>
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		<title>By: Nel P</title>
		<link>http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/comment-page-1/#comment-108186</link>
		<dc:creator>Nel P</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 04 Aug 2009 06:00:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/#comment-108186</guid>
		<description>Majority of those who believe college is not as effective or important are themselves:

1. Not in college.
2. Have not finished college.
3. Do not like the discipline of doing all those learning stuff that they think might not even be used in the future. 
4. Are in the different line of work - far from what they studied earlier.
5. Are finding it easy to justify against it because it did not work with them.
6. Believe that a diploma alone is a ticket to a job - guess what, not!. 
7. Are less likely to get hired over the one that went to college.

School is for education, education is for learning, learning for growth. If you went to school and did not try to learn or have not learned how to actually apply learning into real-life, then that is when it turns into waste.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Majority of those who believe college is not as effective or important are themselves:</p>
<p>1. Not in college.<br />
2. Have not finished college.<br />
3. Do not like the discipline of doing all those learning stuff that they think might not even be used in the future.<br />
4. Are in the different line of work &#8211; far from what they studied earlier.<br />
5. Are finding it easy to justify against it because it did not work with them.<br />
6. Believe that a diploma alone is a ticket to a job &#8211; guess what, not!.<br />
7. Are less likely to get hired over the one that went to college.</p>
<p>School is for education, education is for learning, learning for growth. If you went to school and did not try to learn or have not learned how to actually apply learning into real-life, then that is when it turns into waste.</p>
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		<title>By: Frank Gerber</title>
		<link>http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/comment-page-1/#comment-101524</link>
		<dc:creator>Frank Gerber</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 18:32:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/#comment-101524</guid>
		<description>As a 50 year old man, that did not complete an official B.S until several years ago, but had enough credits for a masters, just not the right ones. Let me tell you a degree is seen as a certification, it will get you jobs that would be filtered out to you, by not having one and help to keep your job when things get tight . It will be the best investment you ever made but do not over pay for it. Ivory League is great if you come from money, if not be creative. Two years of community + two years of a state school will do you fine. If you just can&#039;t take the grind of the education mill anymore, take a class or two at night. But do it online, many times an interruption in life or place or work makes hard to get to a Brick and mortar school. And new schools mean lost credits. School is good, but honestly does not provide more than an introductory base to what you learn on the Job. But it is a accreditation that can not be replaced. Even if you should happen to prove to a company that you are irreplaceable, you will have a tough time if you need to find a new one for better money or  because of company down sizing. The leaning part is only 30%, the certification is part that counts and stays with you no matter what.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a 50 year old man, that did not complete an official B.S until several years ago, but had enough credits for a masters, just not the right ones. Let me tell you a degree is seen as a certification, it will get you jobs that would be filtered out to you, by not having one and help to keep your job when things get tight . It will be the best investment you ever made but do not over pay for it. Ivory League is great if you come from money, if not be creative. Two years of community + two years of a state school will do you fine. If you just can&#8217;t take the grind of the education mill anymore, take a class or two at night. But do it online, many times an interruption in life or place or work makes hard to get to a Brick and mortar school. And new schools mean lost credits. School is good, but honestly does not provide more than an introductory base to what you learn on the Job. But it is a accreditation that can not be replaced. Even if you should happen to prove to a company that you are irreplaceable, you will have a tough time if you need to find a new one for better money or  because of company down sizing. The leaning part is only 30%, the certification is part that counts and stays with you no matter what.</p>
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		<title>By: jack</title>
		<link>http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/comment-page-1/#comment-92652</link>
		<dc:creator>jack</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 10 Feb 2009 20:01:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/#comment-92652</guid>
		<description>I agree with Dave ^ That is the way things should be done, %100 college is a bullshit business. The most successful people in the world that i have come across, like steve jobs, henry ford, and donald trump, made their fortunes organizing people who were good at what they did to work towards a common purpose. Even einstein took credit for calculations people much smarter than him made, but because of his vision and organizational skills to bring great minds together, he was seen as the genius. I wont tell you my name, but I am one of the fortune 500, I have didn&#039;t go to college and I am a self made billionaire. College is for cattle.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with Dave ^ That is the way things should be done, %100 college is a bullshit business. The most successful people in the world that i have come across, like steve jobs, henry ford, and donald trump, made their fortunes organizing people who were good at what they did to work towards a common purpose. Even einstein took credit for calculations people much smarter than him made, but because of his vision and organizational skills to bring great minds together, he was seen as the genius. I wont tell you my name, but I am one of the fortune 500, I have didn&#8217;t go to college and I am a self made billionaire. College is for cattle.</p>
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		<title>By: Dave</title>
		<link>http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/comment-page-1/#comment-69987</link>
		<dc:creator>Dave</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 May 2008 03:53:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/#comment-69987</guid>
		<description>I am a hiring manager. I care about two things - your ability to do the job and your ability to contribute to the bottom line. I&#039;ve never hired anybody on the basis of their education.

There was a time when you became a lawyer by studying with other lawyers...a doctor the same way. Licensure came about and now &#039;without a degree&#039; you can&#039;t become those things.

Remember: College is a BUSINESS - Big business!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I am a hiring manager. I care about two things &#8211; your ability to do the job and your ability to contribute to the bottom line. I&#8217;ve never hired anybody on the basis of their education.</p>
<p>There was a time when you became a lawyer by studying with other lawyers&#8230;a doctor the same way. Licensure came about and now &#8216;without a degree&#8217; you can&#8217;t become those things.</p>
<p>Remember: College is a BUSINESS &#8211; Big business!!</p>
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		<title>By: Nate</title>
		<link>http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/comment-page-1/#comment-68783</link>
		<dc:creator>Nate</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 01 May 2008 11:38:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.fireandknowledge.org/archives/2008/04/30/how-important-is-college/#comment-68783</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m under the impression now that undergrad is good, but a little skeptical of grad school.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m under the impression now that undergrad is good, but a little skeptical of grad school.</p>
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